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	<title>Comments on: M&amp;C Question: Rosary gifts</title>
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		<title>By: Tom Zelaney</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/comment-page-1/#comment-5322</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Zelaney</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:23:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/#comment-5322</guid>
		<description>Irish Catholic wrote: &quot;(I think) Catholics believe that Jesus and the Holy Ghost are extensions of God, that enable Him to conveniently or efficiently execute His will in different ways. They share one intelligence and one personality. God and the Holy Ghost exist as spirits only (although their precise distinction is unclear to me). Jesus may exist as spirit only (today).
Please correct me if Iâ€™ve misrepresented the Catholic perspective. I am curious about it and have many questions to ask, but will save them until someone can confirm or correct my statements so far.&quot;

Personally I believe we may have a better description if we use the old stndard Balimore cathechism:

LESSON THIRD: ON THE UNITY AND TRINITY OF GOD 
Dis-tinct&#039;, separate, different. 
Di-vine&#039; Na&#039;ture, that which is one in God. 
E&#039;qual, another just as great and perfect as Himself - 
In&#039;fi-nite, the most perfect possible. 
Su-preme&#039;, above all. 
Trin&#039;i-ty, three in one. 
U&#039;ni-ty, being only one. 
21. Q. Is there but one God?
A. Yes; there is but one God. 

22. Q. Why can there be but one God?
A. There can be but one God, because God, being supreme and infinite, cannot have an equal. 

23. Q. How many Persons are there in God?
A. In God there are three Divine Persons, really distinct, and equal in all things-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. 

24. Q. Is the Father God?
A. The Father is God and the first Person of the Blessed Trinity. 

25. Q. Is the Son God?
A. The Son is God and the second Person of the Blessed Trinity. 

26. Q. Is the Holy Ghost God?
A. The Holy Ghost is God and the third Person of the Blessed Trinity. 

27. Q. What is the Blessed Trinity?
A. The Blessed Trinity is one God in three Divine Persons. 

29. Q. Are the three Divine Persons one and the same God?
A. The three Divine Persons are one and the same God, having one and the same Divine nature. 

I paste this here just in the interests of clarity and simplicity.  In this we do not see Christ and the Holy Spirit as extension of God but as three distinct persons in onw God.  Utimately the Triune God or Trinity is a mystery.  Elucidation of this mystery can only proceed so far under human reason.  Great care should be exercised in going beyond the catechism as even theolgoians in the past such as Abelard have gotten themselves into hot water over trying to push back the mystery beyond what is possible in human reason.

When Moses is confronted by the burning bush, he quite reasonabley ask God for His Name that he might tell the hebrews who has sent him.  The Lord replie, &quot;Tell them that I am who am has sent you.&quot;  By this accidental information, Thomas Aquinas was able to finally join the first principle of Metaphysics with the God of Revelation, the Christian God is Existence itself, an infinite ocean of existence, his essence is to BE.  Only such a God can be a creator, can bring into existence that which is NOT.

God is totally other and to say he is spirit is the best we can do but not sufficient to express Him.

in Mormonism this is not God as they conceive it.  The Father God was once a man like us who achieved His perfection and now rules over our planet and who breeds spirit children with his now spiritual wives and we are those spirit children now born in the flesh.  Christ is the son, born in the same way by intercourse with Mary.  I&#039;m not completely familiar with mormon teaching regarding the Spirt, the Revelator and his engendering.  But Mary is not Ever-Virgin,nor is she the God Bearer, the Theotokos of the Orthodox nor was she immaculately conceived nor assumed into heaven.  Mormons would not thinks of praying to Mary to intercede with Christ her Son for their benefit or help as would Catholics.  And actually, many first presidents of the LDS play down having a relatonship with Jesus Christ that is so important in Catholic prayer life and in Catholic mystical theology.

Hope this helps and maybe one of our Mormon friwnds can correct me on my take on their beliefs to clarify waht they really believe.

Tom Z</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Irish Catholic wrote: &#8220;(I think) Catholics believe that Jesus and the Holy Ghost are extensions of God, that enable Him to conveniently or efficiently execute His will in different ways. They share one intelligence and one personality. God and the Holy Ghost exist as spirits only (although their precise distinction is unclear to me). Jesus may exist as spirit only (today).<br />
Please correct me if Iâ€™ve misrepresented the Catholic perspective. I am curious about it and have many questions to ask, but will save them until someone can confirm or correct my statements so far.&#8221;</p>
<p>Personally I believe we may have a better description if we use the old stndard Balimore cathechism:</p>
<p>LESSON THIRD: ON THE UNITY AND TRINITY OF GOD<br />
Dis-tinct&#8217;, separate, different.<br />
Di-vine&#8217; Na&#8217;ture, that which is one in God.<br />
E&#8217;qual, another just as great and perfect as Himself &#8211;<br />
In&#8217;fi-nite, the most perfect possible.<br />
Su-preme&#8217;, above all.<br />
Trin&#8217;i-ty, three in one.<br />
U&#8217;ni-ty, being only one.<br />
21. Q. Is there but one God?<br />
A. Yes; there is but one God. </p>
<p>22. Q. Why can there be but one God?<br />
A. There can be but one God, because God, being supreme and infinite, cannot have an equal. </p>
<p>23. Q. How many Persons are there in God?<br />
A. In God there are three Divine Persons, really distinct, and equal in all things-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost. </p>
<p>24. Q. Is the Father God?<br />
A. The Father is God and the first Person of the Blessed Trinity. </p>
<p>25. Q. Is the Son God?<br />
A. The Son is God and the second Person of the Blessed Trinity. </p>
<p>26. Q. Is the Holy Ghost God?<br />
A. The Holy Ghost is God and the third Person of the Blessed Trinity. </p>
<p>27. Q. What is the Blessed Trinity?<br />
A. The Blessed Trinity is one God in three Divine Persons. </p>
<p>29. Q. Are the three Divine Persons one and the same God?<br />
A. The three Divine Persons are one and the same God, having one and the same Divine nature. </p>
<p>I paste this here just in the interests of clarity and simplicity.  In this we do not see Christ and the Holy Spirit as extension of God but as three distinct persons in onw God.  Utimately the Triune God or Trinity is a mystery.  Elucidation of this mystery can only proceed so far under human reason.  Great care should be exercised in going beyond the catechism as even theolgoians in the past such as Abelard have gotten themselves into hot water over trying to push back the mystery beyond what is possible in human reason.</p>
<p>When Moses is confronted by the burning bush, he quite reasonabley ask God for His Name that he might tell the hebrews who has sent him.  The Lord replie, &#8220;Tell them that I am who am has sent you.&#8221;  By this accidental information, Thomas Aquinas was able to finally join the first principle of Metaphysics with the God of Revelation, the Christian God is Existence itself, an infinite ocean of existence, his essence is to BE.  Only such a God can be a creator, can bring into existence that which is NOT.</p>
<p>God is totally other and to say he is spirit is the best we can do but not sufficient to express Him.</p>
<p>in Mormonism this is not God as they conceive it.  The Father God was once a man like us who achieved His perfection and now rules over our planet and who breeds spirit children with his now spiritual wives and we are those spirit children now born in the flesh.  Christ is the son, born in the same way by intercourse with Mary.  I&#8217;m not completely familiar with mormon teaching regarding the Spirt, the Revelator and his engendering.  But Mary is not Ever-Virgin,nor is she the God Bearer, the Theotokos of the Orthodox nor was she immaculately conceived nor assumed into heaven.  Mormons would not thinks of praying to Mary to intercede with Christ her Son for their benefit or help as would Catholics.  And actually, many first presidents of the LDS play down having a relatonship with Jesus Christ that is so important in Catholic prayer life and in Catholic mystical theology.</p>
<p>Hope this helps and maybe one of our Mormon friwnds can correct me on my take on their beliefs to clarify waht they really believe.</p>
<p>Tom Z</p>
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		<title>By: gwilliams</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/comment-page-1/#comment-4424</link>
		<dc:creator>gwilliams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 05:51:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/#comment-4424</guid>
		<description>Sorry, I&#039;m new to the forum and didn&#039;t get my blockquote to work the way I intended.  Everything that appeared in the above blockquote was my own words, not IrishCatholic&#039;s.  I apologize for any confusion.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sorry, I&#8217;m new to the forum and didn&#8217;t get my blockquote to work the way I intended.  Everything that appeared in the above blockquote was my own words, not IrishCatholic&#8217;s.  I apologize for any confusion.</p>
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		<title>By: gwilliams</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/comment-page-1/#comment-4423</link>
		<dc:creator>gwilliams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Mar 2007 05:50:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/#comment-4423</guid>
		<description>IrishCatholic wrote:
&lt;blockquote cite=&quot;The Holy Trinity which consists of God our father, Jesus the son of God and The Holy Spirit are all three part of the Mormon faith, correct?&quot;&gt;

My understanding of the Mormon Godhead and the Catholic Trinity are as follows.  (I apologize for writing &lt;i&gt;God&lt;/i&gt; and &lt;i&gt;Jesus&lt;/i&gt; so many times...I would prefer to use The Father and The Son because these names are sacred, but in this instance it would be somewhat verbose and possibly confusing.)

Latter-Day Saints believe that the the relationship between God and Jesus (in the spirit sense) is similar to the relationship between your father and you (in the flesh sense).  God is also the father of our spirits, and this makes Jesus literally our elder brother in spirit.  God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are three distinct beings with three distinct intelligences and personalities.  God must converse with Jesus (even today) to inform Him of His will.  God and Jesus both have perfect and un-corruptible physical bodies of flesh and bone (but, as exalted beings, their internal organs may differ from ours and serve different purposes; we will eventually obtain similar bodies when we are resurrected).  The Holy Ghost does not have a body, and He exists as a spirit only.  As a spirit, the Holy Ghost can effectively be everywhere simultaneously, and He acts as a sort of messenger to all, but some of us are more receptive to His promptings than others, according to our faithfulness, and also depending on whether we&#039;ve received the Gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying-on of hands (which is usually performed within one week of being baptized by water).  I could expound upon this a little, but would prefer to check the details first.  God and Jesus are one in purpose, but physically and mentally distinct.

(I think) Catholics believe that Jesus and the Holy Ghost are extensions of God, that enable Him to conveniently or efficiently execute His will in different ways.  They share one intelligence and one personality.  God and the Holy Ghost exist as spirits only (although their precise distinction is unclear to me).  Jesus may exist as spirit only (today).

Please correct me if I&#039;ve misrepresented the Catholic perspective.  I am curious about it and have many questions to ask, but will save them until someone can confirm or correct my statements so far.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IrishCatholic wrote:</p>
<blockquote cite="The Holy Trinity which consists of God our father, Jesus the son of God and The Holy Spirit are all three part of the Mormon faith, correct?">
<p>My understanding of the Mormon Godhead and the Catholic Trinity are as follows.  (I apologize for writing <i>God</i> and <i>Jesus</i> so many times&#8230;I would prefer to use The Father and The Son because these names are sacred, but in this instance it would be somewhat verbose and possibly confusing.)</p>
<p>Latter-Day Saints believe that the the relationship between God and Jesus (in the spirit sense) is similar to the relationship between your father and you (in the flesh sense).  God is also the father of our spirits, and this makes Jesus literally our elder brother in spirit.  God, Jesus, and the Holy Ghost are three distinct beings with three distinct intelligences and personalities.  God must converse with Jesus (even today) to inform Him of His will.  God and Jesus both have perfect and un-corruptible physical bodies of flesh and bone (but, as exalted beings, their internal organs may differ from ours and serve different purposes; we will eventually obtain similar bodies when we are resurrected).  The Holy Ghost does not have a body, and He exists as a spirit only.  As a spirit, the Holy Ghost can effectively be everywhere simultaneously, and He acts as a sort of messenger to all, but some of us are more receptive to His promptings than others, according to our faithfulness, and also depending on whether we&#8217;ve received the Gift of the Holy Ghost by the laying-on of hands (which is usually performed within one week of being baptized by water).  I could expound upon this a little, but would prefer to check the details first.  God and Jesus are one in purpose, but physically and mentally distinct.</p>
<p>(I think) Catholics believe that Jesus and the Holy Ghost are extensions of God, that enable Him to conveniently or efficiently execute His will in different ways.  They share one intelligence and one personality.  God and the Holy Ghost exist as spirits only (although their precise distinction is unclear to me).  Jesus may exist as spirit only (today).</p>
<p>Please correct me if I&#8217;ve misrepresented the Catholic perspective.  I am curious about it and have many questions to ask, but will save them until someone can confirm or correct my statements so far.</p></blockquote>
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		<title>By: IrishCatholic</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/comment-page-1/#comment-4396</link>
		<dc:creator>IrishCatholic</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Mar 2007 22:36:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/#comment-4396</guid>
		<description>The Holy Trinity which consists of God our father, Jesus the son of God and The Holy Spirit are all three part of the Mormon faith, correct? So please explain to me what you meant by &quot;i didn&#039;t explain anything, because i wanted no ill feeling to occur&quot;. I am truly interested in the similarities of our religions. I find that the family values of the LDS people that I am proud to call my friends are completly in line with the family teachings  I was brought up to live by. I could discuss this with any one of them, however we do not speak about religion very often.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Holy Trinity which consists of God our father, Jesus the son of God and The Holy Spirit are all three part of the Mormon faith, correct? So please explain to me what you meant by &#8220;i didn&#8217;t explain anything, because i wanted no ill feeling to occur&#8221;. I am truly interested in the similarities of our religions. I find that the family values of the LDS people that I am proud to call my friends are completly in line with the family teachings  I was brought up to live by. I could discuss this with any one of them, however we do not speak about religion very often.</p>
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		<title>By: tipseylockett</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/comment-page-1/#comment-3869</link>
		<dc:creator>tipseylockett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Feb 2007 01:12:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/#comment-3869</guid>
		<description>i have many catholics in my family (my husband being one), i am LDS. i truely know that Jesus Christ is my brother, and i am grateful to know i have a Heavenly Father, however, i believe Mary was a very important woman........she gave birth to our Savior.......however, there it ends, i dont think she will pray for us.......see the thing is , it is all about ......Jesus Christ and Heavenly Father.......no one else really.........our individual relationship with them, and we are blessed to have the Holy Ghost who testifys to us of the truth of all things........The God Head..........
i was with a catholic the other day and the &quot;Sacred Heart&quot; was mentioned, i had no idea what it was........well it turns out it is the trinity........i didnt explain anything, because i wanted no ill feeling to occour.......you see the comment had been made to the effect........&quot; not protestant, just not catholics. there is only one religion Catholic&quot;.....this is why we have wars....and she is a wonderful elderly lady...........</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>i have many catholics in my family (my husband being one), i am LDS. i truely know that Jesus Christ is my brother, and i am grateful to know i have a Heavenly Father, however, i believe Mary was a very important woman&#8230;&#8230;..she gave birth to our Savior&#8230;&#8230;.however, there it ends, i dont think she will pray for us&#8230;&#8230;.see the thing is , it is all about &#8230;&#8230;Jesus Christ and Heavenly Father&#8230;&#8230;.no one else really&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;our individual relationship with them, and we are blessed to have the Holy Ghost who testifys to us of the truth of all things&#8230;&#8230;..The God Head&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.<br />
i was with a catholic the other day and the &#8220;Sacred Heart&#8221; was mentioned, i had no idea what it was&#8230;&#8230;..well it turns out it is the trinity&#8230;&#8230;..i didnt explain anything, because i wanted no ill feeling to occour&#8230;&#8230;.you see the comment had been made to the effect&#8230;&#8230;..&#8221; not protestant, just not catholics. there is only one religion Catholic&#8221;&#8230;..this is why we have wars&#8230;.and she is a wonderful elderly lady&#8230;&#8230;&#8230;..</p>
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		<title>By: Atticus</title>
		<link>http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/comment-page-1/#comment-1880</link>
		<dc:creator>Atticus</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Dec 2006 03:29:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.mormonandcatholic.org/mc-question-rosary-gifts/#comment-1880</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I just omit the parts of the Hail Marys that ask Mary to pray for us because thatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s not what I believe.&lt;/i&gt;

Why wouldn&#039;t you want Mary to pray for you?  I take all the prayers I can get.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I just omit the parts of the Hail Marys that ask Mary to pray for us because thatÃ¢â‚¬â„¢s not what I believe.</i></p>
<p>Why wouldn&#8217;t you want Mary to pray for you?  I take all the prayers I can get.</p>
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